Daystar Calcium H Quark

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Montana
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Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Montana » Sat Nov 28, 2015 7:37 pm

This is something I cannot get my head round, they say it will 5A however my Omega Bob filter is 5A wide and it only shows WL views. Does anyone have the transmission graph for this 5A filter to compare with the Omega Bob one. I'd like to know how big the base is compared to the filter I have.
Omega Bob Calcium H filter.jpg
Omega Bob Calcium H filter.jpg (170.24 KiB) Viewed 3085 times
However, to be able to see in Calcium H surely you need less than 2A as you can see from this graph even 2A covers all the adjacent bands?

ImageCommercial bandwidths by Alexandra Hart, on Flickr

ImageCalcium K1 K2 K3 by Alexandra Hart, on Flickr

How can 5A be even remotely useful?
I see wonderful images from Peter, Highfinum, Merlin's friend and Wah and they are looking at 0.5A to see the H1,H2,H3 regions, only these can show the true chromospheric regions.

I was very surprised to hear the Quark will be 5A and I just can't get my head round it even if the base of the transmission is 5A wide :?: can anyone enlighten me?

Alexandra

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Merlin66 » Sat Nov 28, 2015 11:36 pm

Alexandra,
Great assessment of the issues involved with detailed resolution in the Ca wavelengths.
IMHO the marketing of a 5A Ca filter is to provide a "competitive" product to the casual solar observer - the bandwidth may provide (if your eyes still work below 400nm) a brighter image for visual.
The 0.5A used to record the finer details would not provide any "visual" image.
My 2c.
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Solar B » Sun Nov 29, 2015 2:35 pm

I think its a case of riding this one out to see what folks think of the new H-line

Certainly their current (more expensive ) H-lines are also rated at 5.0A so there's

got to be something in it ... most likely best suited for visual use.

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Merlin66 » Tue Dec 01, 2015 7:34 am

Alexandra,
I'm surprised by the lack of comment......
You did an excellent job of presenting the data....
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Montana » Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:03 am

Thanks Merlin, yes I am surprised too. I would love to compare my filter transmission curve to the Quark version, perhaps it has an extremely narrow base allowing for more than WL viewing?
5A can't be to allow better visual, what is the point of more light if it is continuum light? the Lunt at 2.4A is very very bright.

Alexandra

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Valery » Tue Dec 01, 2015 12:05 pm

Montana wrote:
the Lunt at 2.4A is very very bright.

Alexandra
Hi Alexandra,

I barely see the sun through my filter combination (Edmund 390nm + PST #2 + PST#1) and this is without a telescope! With a telescope I can't see through this filters combo).

What is the magnification (per inch of aperture) do you use with Lunt CaK and see the sun very bright? How much brighter the Lunt than such my combination?


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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Montana » Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:07 pm

CaK PST I can barely guess there is a purple haze there.
Lunt CaK module on a 100mm f10 Celestron the Sun is as bright as hydrogen alpha filtered disc. Can see every detail the same as any pic.

Alexandra

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Valery » Tue Dec 01, 2015 3:50 pm

Montana wrote:CaK PST I can barely guess there is a purple haze there.
Lunt CaK module on a 100mm f10 Celestron the Sun is as bright as hydrogen alpha filtered disc. Can see every detail the same as any pic.

Alexandra
What is your particular Lunt CaK diagonal?


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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by marktownley » Tue Dec 01, 2015 4:24 pm

I'd read this, but in the absence of hard facts had refrained from answering, however, i'll throw in a couple of personal opinions...

I think that there is a CaH quark because CaK filters exist already, and Daystar is trying to widen it's market by appealing to more of us solar freaks by throwing in a different wavelength. Lunt have got the CaK market in the now absence of Coronado there.

I've no idea what the view through the CaH filter will look like, but the views and images through Walters 5a daystar CaH were very much like a washed out CaK, or if you prefer a white light on some steroids, better than the Baader K-line, but no where near CaK. Infact both myself and Walter had made our own CaK filters that gave more contrasty views than his CaH filter and we disregarded them because of the results we knew we could get in CaK.

I won't be rushing to get a CaH Quark, but will watch with interest the results others get.
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Montana » Wed Dec 02, 2015 11:10 am

That is what I thought Mark, it will be similar to my £200 CaH filter. I know which I would rather get for the money :(

Valery, just the regular B1800 diagonal.

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Valery » Wed Dec 02, 2015 12:15 pm

Montana wrote:That is what I thought Mark, it will be similar to my £200 CaH filter. I know which I would rather get for the money :(

Valery, just the regular B1800 diagonal.

Alexandra
Thanks, Alexandra!

Does your husband sees the sun through this B1800 CaK same bright as H-a images? And how old is he?


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Last edited by Valery on Thu Dec 03, 2015 10:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Montana » Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:00 pm

Yes, he loves it that is why we bought it for him. Sometimes he sits and stares for an hour, I think he prefers visual to imaging. He is 48 nearly 49.

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Astrograph » Thu Dec 03, 2015 9:49 am

The CaH Quark does seem to be aimed primarily at visual applications. I have asked Daystar repeatedly for more specific information but they will provide nothing.

Personally I think its a bit of a pointless product. Calcium is not the easiest thing because your eyes just don't work that well at those wavelengths plus long term exposure to sub 400nm can't be that good for your eyes. A 5A bandpass is also not exactly difficult to achieve with just a regular dielectric filter and much cheaper.

The CaH Quark will be the same price as a regular Quark to which you need to add an ERF and a tele-centric unless you stop down to about F15. All this will get you up over £1000.

I sell the Lunt B1200 Cak Module which needs nothing adding to work for £1150 and that's 2A. Much more versatile photographically.

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Valery » Thu Dec 03, 2015 10:36 am

Montana wrote:Yes, he loves it that is why we bought it for him. Sometimes he sits and stares for an hour, I think he prefers visual to imaging. He is 48 nearly 49.

Alexandra

Thanks Alexandra.

It seems I need to buy a Lunt CaK diagonal and use my PST filter for imaging only or as a double stack with a Lunt.



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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by marktownley » Thu Dec 03, 2015 10:31 pm

Astrograph wrote:Personally I think its a bit of a pointless product. Calcium is not the easiest thing because your eyes just don't work that well at those wavelengths plus long term exposure to sub 400nm can't be that good for your eyes. A 5A bandpass is also not exactly difficult to achieve with just a regular dielectric filter and much cheaper.

The CaH Quark will be the same price as a regular Quark to which you need to add an ERF and a tele-centric unless you stop down to about F15. All this will get you up over £1000.

I sell the Lunt B1200 Cak Module which needs nothing adding to work for £1150 and that's 2A. Much more versatile photographically.
Completely agree Rupert. I really hope we're all proved wrong by the CaH Quark, but I think we have summed it up well in this post.
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Valery » Fri Dec 04, 2015 12:31 am

marktownley wrote: I really hope we're all proved wrong by the CaH Quark, but I think we have summed it up well in this post.
Even if so, I personally don't see any sense in buying CaH Quark vs bright and stable Lunt CaK diagonal or straight module. Lunt does not require heating, has much narrower bandpass (so, much better contrast) and I have heard about only one crap sample - a B600 CaK diagonal, while a crappy Quark is not a seldom thing.

For DayStar better be focused on their regular H-a Quarks significant improvement, IMHO.


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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by christian viladrich » Sat Jan 09, 2016 7:00 pm

Hello Alexandra,
Just an input there ... Bob Omega filters can be really poor ...this might be the explanation.
The Ca K Barr filter I used is 2.4 A FWHM and gives good results visually. A 5 A FWHM should also do it.

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Derek Klepp » Mon Jan 11, 2016 5:20 am

Alexandra I am just a bit older than Hubby and through my CaK I see nothing in detail.Too many years in the hard Australian Sun.Luckily the camera version with the B1200 is fine

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by GuillermoBarrancos » Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:35 pm

I always thought that CaK was only for imaging and not to be used visually? :?

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Astrograph » Mon Jan 25, 2016 9:45 am

The Calcium Quark is H Line, not K Line and so easier to see. I have the first one in the UK arriving this week so if the sun shines we will see what all the fuss is about and if its worth ordering more!

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by DSobserver » Mon Jan 25, 2016 12:05 pm

Cak can also be visual but dim....Nevertheless the vision is similar to picture with high constrats between dark blue and white areas! That's a distirbing vision

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by GuillermoBarrancos » Mon Jan 25, 2016 1:50 pm

Ok. Thanks for the clarification. Will be interesting to see first like with the new Calcium quark and how it stacks up to the competition.

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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by marktownley » Mon Jan 25, 2016 2:44 pm

Astrograph wrote:The Calcium Quark is H Line, not K Line and so easier to see. I have the first one in the UK arriving this week so if the sun shines we will see what all the fuss is about and if its worth ordering more!
Thursday is looking the best day...

I think I should review it for you for S@N magazine ;)
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by Astrograph » Mon Jan 25, 2016 3:01 pm

Oh Mark, tell me your not working for that rag!

You can have it after Astrofest for review if you like as long as its not away for months. Let me know.

If it's in by Thursday I shall attempt to give it a go once I see what I have that will work well around 400nm. APM 2.7x works very well at 400nm so that on most scopes will get F17-22 which should be fine.

This is an image Daystar sent using a 100mm F15. Looks very 'K-Line'. I think it shows some promise although I would like to try and get in very close to see if we can get any nice swirly details.
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Re: Daystar Calcium H Quark

Post by highfnum » Wed Jan 27, 2016 9:32 pm

sorry i just saw this thread
time tells all truths
I think it depend of how tight "skirt" is at bottom of curve
I can understand your doubts

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