Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in maintenance
- sullij1
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in maintenance
Very cool stuff boys! I will be lurking watching the action.
Look Up!
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in maintenance
Walter,
What Dave is saying is position the torch immediately behind a hole in a large(ish) piece of card and locate that at 8300mm (near enough to start with.....)in front of the mirror.
When the lamp is pointed at the mirror the reflection should be seen on the card close by the lamp aperture.....slowly move the lamp/card until you get the best focus (of the lamp) on the card.
That will measure the radius of curvature, the focal length is half this....
Make any sense??
What Dave is saying is position the torch immediately behind a hole in a large(ish) piece of card and locate that at 8300mm (near enough to start with.....)in front of the mirror.
When the lamp is pointed at the mirror the reflection should be seen on the card close by the lamp aperture.....slowly move the lamp/card until you get the best focus (of the lamp) on the card.
That will measure the radius of curvature, the focal length is half this....
Make any sense??
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- swisswalter
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in maintenance
Hi Dave, Hi Ken
thank you very much for your comment and help. We do not disagree. The test I used gives indeed the same result as your procedure described ( see also www.stathis-firstlight.de ). That procedure I used is a very common first test of a mirror while grinding it. I had the primary filter filled with light but was not able to take a pic of that situation because it reacts immediately of any little missalignment. Using the laser to measure the distance was just an additional check, and it works.
Next to that I meausred the curvature of the mirror, it is below 0,4 mm and above 0,3 mm, which gives the same result ~4,2 m focal length t= (D/2)2/2xR)
thank you very much for your comment and help. We do not disagree. The test I used gives indeed the same result as your procedure described ( see also www.stathis-firstlight.de ). That procedure I used is a very common first test of a mirror while grinding it. I had the primary filter filled with light but was not able to take a pic of that situation because it reacts immediately of any little missalignment. Using the laser to measure the distance was just an additional check, and it works.
Next to that I meausred the curvature of the mirror, it is below 0,4 mm and above 0,3 mm, which gives the same result ~4,2 m focal length t= (D/2)2/2xR)
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi mod gang
we are back again. I have received the broken part and I'm going to assemble the ceolostat the next weeks. Stay tuned.
we are back again. I have received the broken part and I'm going to assemble the ceolostat the next weeks. Stay tuned.
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Walter!
Keep us all updated.
Keep us all updated.
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Mark
I'm so happy that you have managed to get into the forum again too. I would have been feeling lost without you buddy. Did you notice that you have lost posting points as well as me. I'm a very new member to that forum, just joined it ;-) but I have already some hundreds post's ;-)
Hope you all over there stay dry (not meaning wine, beer etc. ;-) ) and safe
I'm so happy that you have managed to get into the forum again too. I would have been feeling lost without you buddy. Did you notice that you have lost posting points as well as me. I'm a very new member to that forum, just joined it ;-) but I have already some hundreds post's ;-)
Hope you all over there stay dry (not meaning wine, beer etc. ;-) ) and safe
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Very impressive Walter!
Please keep us posted
Please keep us posted
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Alex
thank you very much. I will :-)
thank you very much. I will :-)
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Finally after 14 days without sunshine I took the chance to measure the FL in bright sunshine
The FL is 4180 mm. The diameter of the disk hitting the camera is ~45 mm
The FL is 4180 mm. The diameter of the disk hitting the camera is ~45 mm
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Last edited by swisswalter on Sun Feb 16, 2014 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
temporary setup on the garden table
the swiss clock drive
Here you see also what has to be done regarding cleaning
The 12 o'clock position of the primary mirror
a riddle to be still solved (swiss hieroglyphs) Maybe somebody has a hint
the secondary temporarely positioned in the garden
finding a place higher up the facade
the swiss clock drive
Here you see also what has to be done regarding cleaning
The 12 o'clock position of the primary mirror
a riddle to be still solved (swiss hieroglyphs) Maybe somebody has a hint
the secondary temporarely positioned in the garden
finding a place higher up the facade
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
and now back inside
the workroom setup for cleaning
the first cleaned pieces, there are many many more to be cleaned
the workroom setup for cleaning
the first cleaned pieces, there are many many more to be cleaned
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Walter,
I think what the symbols mean is that if the Sun is drifting downward then you want to move the slow motion control in the direction the arrow is pointing to recenter the image.
- Dave
I think what the symbols mean is that if the Sun is drifting downward then you want to move the slow motion control in the direction the arrow is pointing to recenter the image.
- Dave
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
This apparatus makes me think of:
"Alles Touristen Und Non-technishen Lookens Peepers!
Das Machine control is Nicht Fur Gerfingenpoken Und Mittengrabben.
Oderwise is Easy Schnappen Der Springenwerk, Blowenfuse, Und Poppencorken Mit Spitzensparken.
Der Machine is Diggen by Experten Only. Is Nicht Fur Gerverken by Das Dummkopfen.
Das Rubberneken Sightseenen Keepen Das Cottonpicken Hands in Das Pockets, So Relaxen Und Watchen Das Blinkenlights."
Interesting story of it's resurrection.
"Alles Touristen Und Non-technishen Lookens Peepers!
Das Machine control is Nicht Fur Gerfingenpoken Und Mittengrabben.
Oderwise is Easy Schnappen Der Springenwerk, Blowenfuse, Und Poppencorken Mit Spitzensparken.
Der Machine is Diggen by Experten Only. Is Nicht Fur Gerverken by Das Dummkopfen.
Das Rubberneken Sightseenen Keepen Das Cottonpicken Hands in Das Pockets, So Relaxen Und Watchen Das Blinkenlights."
Interesting story of it's resurrection.
Beginner amateur astronomer, keen on solar astronomy.
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Peter Williams wrote:This apparatus makes me think of:
"Alles Touristen Und Non-technishen Lookens Peepers!
Das Machine control is Nicht Fur Gerfingenpoken Und Mittengrabben.
Oderwise is Easy Schnappen Der Springenwerk, Blowenfuse, Und Poppencorken Mit Spitzensparken.
Der Machine is Diggen by Experten Only. Is Nicht Fur Gerverken by Das Dummkopfen.
Das Rubberneken Sightseenen Keepen Das Cottonpicken Hands in Das Pockets, So Relaxen Und Watchen Das Blinkenlights."
Interesting story of it's resurrection.
Hi Peter
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
DavidG wrote:Hi Walter,
I think what the symbols mean is that if the Sun is drifting downward then you want to move the slow motion control in the direction the arrow is pointing to recenter the image.
- Dave
Hi Dave
very much. That is a good hint. We will see once installed
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Walter,
I'm interested in the clock drive. The two brass gears attached to the clock look to give a ratio of 1:1 so that means the clock motor itself needs to turning at 1 revolution in 48 hours to track the Sun. Have you measured it's speed ?
- Dave
I'm interested in the clock drive. The two brass gears attached to the clock look to give a ratio of 1:1 so that means the clock motor itself needs to turning at 1 revolution in 48 hours to track the Sun. Have you measured it's speed ?
- Dave
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Dave
It will be 1 revolution in 24 hours, because this is a heliostat, not a coelostat. A coelostat has the tracking mirror fixed in declination with it's surface coincident to the polar axis. To get the beam on the second flat the first flat's mount must be translated north-south as the Sun's declination changes. East-west translation is needed if the second flat shadows the first. A coelostat mirror rotates once in 48 hours and a polar heliostat once in 24 hours. There are a variety of other heliostat configurations, even altazimuth. A heliostat with anything other than the polar configuration will require two axis slow motions at rates depending on the geometry. If Walter's wonderful gadget is polar aligned it will track the Sun if it's turning once per day. Coelostats are more trouble to set up, but there is no image rotation as with a heliostat, which makes a difference in some cases. This is a photo of a coelostat, the tracks for translating the first mirror's mount are seen, the second flat has motor drives for tracking. Takes about a minute to acquire the Sun on average.
Joe
It will be 1 revolution in 24 hours, because this is a heliostat, not a coelostat. A coelostat has the tracking mirror fixed in declination with it's surface coincident to the polar axis. To get the beam on the second flat the first flat's mount must be translated north-south as the Sun's declination changes. East-west translation is needed if the second flat shadows the first. A coelostat mirror rotates once in 48 hours and a polar heliostat once in 24 hours. There are a variety of other heliostat configurations, even altazimuth. A heliostat with anything other than the polar configuration will require two axis slow motions at rates depending on the geometry. If Walter's wonderful gadget is polar aligned it will track the Sun if it's turning once per day. Coelostats are more trouble to set up, but there is no image rotation as with a heliostat, which makes a difference in some cases. This is a photo of a coelostat, the tracks for translating the first mirror's mount are seen, the second flat has motor drives for tracking. Takes about a minute to acquire the Sun on average.
Joe
Observing the Sun with complex optical systems since 1966, and still haven't burned, melted or damaged anything.
Not blind yet, either!
Light pollution? I only observe the Sun, magnitude -26.74. Pollute that!
Not blind yet, either!
Light pollution? I only observe the Sun, magnitude -26.74. Pollute that!
Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Joe,
Thanks for jogging my memory about the Helio vs Ceolostat. I should have remembered the difference since I 'm restoring an original Hale spectrohelioscope that uses a Ceolostat.
- Dave
Thanks for jogging my memory about the Helio vs Ceolostat. I should have remembered the difference since I 'm restoring an original Hale spectrohelioscope that uses a Ceolostat.
- Dave
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Dave, Hi Joe
thank you very much for all your valuable Information.
@Dave yes it seems to be a 1:1 Ratio. I have not yet measured the Speed. I need to get it going, set up and have sunshine for some hours. Wow what a wonderful old piece you are restoring. Good luck.
@Joe thanks for sorting out heliostat versus coelostat. So then my gear is a polar Heliostat, right ? I'll bring it back, it was sold to me as a ceolostat
It is indeed aligned North/south, focuser beeing up north
thank you very much for all your valuable Information.
@Dave yes it seems to be a 1:1 Ratio. I have not yet measured the Speed. I need to get it going, set up and have sunshine for some hours. Wow what a wonderful old piece you are restoring. Good luck.
@Joe thanks for sorting out heliostat versus coelostat. So then my gear is a polar Heliostat, right ? I'll bring it back, it was sold to me as a ceolostat
It is indeed aligned North/south, focuser beeing up north
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
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from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
All fascinating stuff, guys. Very interesting.
Good luck with the restorations.
Stu.
Good luck with the restorations.
Stu.
H-alpha, WL and Ca II K imaging kit for various image scales.
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Fluxgate Magnetometers (1s and 150s Cadence).
Radio meteor detector.
More images at http://www.flickr.com/photos/solarcarbon60/
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Stuart
thank you very much for the good wishes
thank you very much for the good wishes
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Lovely to read how this has been developing Walter! Glad to see you making progress.
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Re: Appenzellersun, Polar Coelostat arrived , now in mainten
Hi Mark
welcome back. Hope you had a great time and the pocket full of pics. We missed you
welcome back. Hope you had a great time and the pocket full of pics. We missed you
Only stardust in the wind, some fine and some less fine scopes, filters and adapters as well. Switzerland 47 N, 9 E, in the heart of EUROPE
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa
from 7 am - 7 pm http://www.nanosys.ch
from 7.01 pm - 6.59 am http://www.wastronomiko.com some times vice versa