31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
-
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6871
- Joined: Mon May 18, 2020 4:45 pm
- Location: Essex, S.E.England
- Been thanked: 4900 times
31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
A question has occurred to me (over many years) as to why those items commonly called "Piers" for mounting telescopes and/or their mounts.
This question seems to be answered in encyclopedias where "Piers" appear to be horizontal structures for such purposes as to be those out into rivers/seas etc., for whatever/obvious purposes.
Whereas, I have never associated "Piers" to be those items used for supporting telescopes and their assemblies, as well as lamps etc., etc.
Surely the correct terminology should be either a "Post" or "Pillar - as both are normally upright and bedded into the ground.
In fact in my case, I have neither a "Pier", "Post" or "Pillar" for my heavy-weight Tri-Scope Assembly and its' equally heavy-duty mount, as is clearly able as a 'four-poster" steel "Stand" to take weights several-times heavier than the loads it is currently designed and made to ever carry. Yes mine has been bolted to a larger and much deeper concrete-base, pile-driven into the ground, so can not really be called anything else other than a "STAND."
So assuming that in the past, an astronomer or astronomical-supplier has decided to call these things "Piers," then who was it and should that name be changed ?
Well let's face it, Pluto as a planet was downgraded to a "Minor-Planet" by astronomers, so I propose that "Telescope-Piers" should no-longer be used to define those items and either "Posts" / "Pillars" or "Stands" should replace the former...
Could it be that a differing-language conversion be the cause of this bad-description ?
If anybody would like to explain to me a better solution to this naming-problem, then please kindly post here and perhaps even to advise the manufacturers/suppliers - that perhaps the correct description should in future be used ???
Mark T's image taken from a "post" on SolarChat from 28-1-2021 onwards (although another name I have used is a "missile in this case) !!!
CLEAR SKIES
Terry
This question seems to be answered in encyclopedias where "Piers" appear to be horizontal structures for such purposes as to be those out into rivers/seas etc., for whatever/obvious purposes.
Whereas, I have never associated "Piers" to be those items used for supporting telescopes and their assemblies, as well as lamps etc., etc.
Surely the correct terminology should be either a "Post" or "Pillar - as both are normally upright and bedded into the ground.
In fact in my case, I have neither a "Pier", "Post" or "Pillar" for my heavy-weight Tri-Scope Assembly and its' equally heavy-duty mount, as is clearly able as a 'four-poster" steel "Stand" to take weights several-times heavier than the loads it is currently designed and made to ever carry. Yes mine has been bolted to a larger and much deeper concrete-base, pile-driven into the ground, so can not really be called anything else other than a "STAND."
So assuming that in the past, an astronomer or astronomical-supplier has decided to call these things "Piers," then who was it and should that name be changed ?
Well let's face it, Pluto as a planet was downgraded to a "Minor-Planet" by astronomers, so I propose that "Telescope-Piers" should no-longer be used to define those items and either "Posts" / "Pillars" or "Stands" should replace the former...
Could it be that a differing-language conversion be the cause of this bad-description ?
If anybody would like to explain to me a better solution to this naming-problem, then please kindly post here and perhaps even to advise the manufacturers/suppliers - that perhaps the correct description should in future be used ???
Mark T's image taken from a "post" on SolarChat from 28-1-2021 onwards (although another name I have used is a "missile in this case) !!!
CLEAR SKIES
Terry
- Attachments
-
- s-l1600 (1).jpg (41.1 KiB) Viewed 1075 times
- DeepSolar64
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 19068
- Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:19 am
- Location: Lowndesville S.C.
- Has thanked: 17853 times
- Been thanked: 16998 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
I think fishing piers, those horizontal structures of wood that extend out beyond the surf get their name from the vertical posts of wood that hold them up. They are the supporting " piers " of the structure. Even bridge columns can be called " piers ". So a pier can also hold a telescope. A single column of steel, aluminum, concrete or even wood. A pier is simply a word for a supporting column,
Lunt 8x32 SUNoculars
Orion 70mm Solar Telescope
Celestron AstroMaster Alt/Az Mount
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 60 DS
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 90 DS
Meade Coronado AZS Alt/Az Mount
Astro-Tech AT72EDII with Altair solar wedge
Celestron NexStar 102GT with Altair solar wedge
Losmandy AZ8 Alt/Az Mount
Sky-Watcher AZGTI Alt-Az GoTo mount
Cameras: ZWO ASI178MM, PGR Grasshopper, PGR Flea
Lunt, Coronado, TeleVue, Orion and Meade eyepieces
Visual Observer
" Way more fun to see it! "
Orion 70mm Solar Telescope
Celestron AstroMaster Alt/Az Mount
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 60 DS
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 90 DS
Meade Coronado AZS Alt/Az Mount
Astro-Tech AT72EDII with Altair solar wedge
Celestron NexStar 102GT with Altair solar wedge
Losmandy AZ8 Alt/Az Mount
Sky-Watcher AZGTI Alt-Az GoTo mount
Cameras: ZWO ASI178MM, PGR Grasshopper, PGR Flea
Lunt, Coronado, TeleVue, Orion and Meade eyepieces
Visual Observer
" Way more fun to see it! "
- rsfoto
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6306
- Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:30 pm
- Location: San Luis Potosi, México
- Has thanked: 9723 times
- Been thanked: 5773 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
Hi Terry,
Is it cloudy at your place ?
Well, interesting question and the only explanation I found is here
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pier
now to dig further into the past would be interesting in the same way that why is the Crow's Nest on a sailing ship called Crow's nest but there are no crows on a sailing ship unless it is docked onto a pier in a harbour unless the surname of the first sailor in using was Crow ...
No it is not cloudy at my place, just waiting that the Sun frees the infamous Palm tree
Is it cloudy at your place ?
Well, interesting question and the only explanation I found is here
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/pier
now to dig further into the past would be interesting in the same way that why is the Crow's Nest on a sailing ship called Crow's nest but there are no crows on a sailing ship unless it is docked onto a pier in a harbour unless the surname of the first sailor in using was Crow ...
No it is not cloudy at my place, just waiting that the Sun frees the infamous Palm tree
regards Rainer
Observatorio Real de 14
San Luis Potosi Mexico
North 22° West 101°
Observatorio Real de 14
San Luis Potosi Mexico
North 22° West 101°
- rsfoto
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6306
- Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:30 pm
- Location: San Luis Potosi, México
- Has thanked: 9723 times
- Been thanked: 5773 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
Hi Terry,
More to the case of a Pier
More to the case of a Pier
regards Rainer
Observatorio Real de 14
San Luis Potosi Mexico
North 22° West 101°
Observatorio Real de 14
San Luis Potosi Mexico
North 22° West 101°
-
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6871
- Joined: Mon May 18, 2020 4:45 pm
- Location: Essex, S.E.England
- Been thanked: 4900 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
Many thanks Gentleman for your quick responses.
Hi James, whilst I agree with your suggestion, I would say that a pier actually sits on either pilings or piers, but effectively the pier itself is the (horizontal) part that acts as a walkway or similar use including railways etc., as in our nearby pier - which apparently is/was the longest in the world at Southend-on-Sea stretching out in to the River Thames for some 1.33 miles (2.14 km).
In fact the Progreso Pier located in the Mexican state of Yucatán as 6.5 Kilometres (4 miles) is longer, but unlike the Southend Pier is for cargo use, compared to our Pleasure Pier. In any case I would find it exceedingly difficult to walk up a pier to the decking it is carrying...
Hi Rainer, No chance of any suitable Sun here and the forecast for the next few days - isn't looking any or much better..
You have submitted another good response and diagram which at least does "support" somewhat the theory that a pier is for "supporting a structure of one sort or another." So on that point alone, should I actually being saying "piering a structure of one sort or another." (as above)
Then again, Lampposts in a street are posts that support lamps/LUMINAIRES etc., of one sort or another, plus the ability to have power-cables inside them - much like telescope "piers" or what I really mean is "Posts/Pillars." Note the similarity of the words Piers and Pillars..
I can of course see from the diagram about "piers" supporting the decking/arches etc., but still feel that for us astronomers, a pole or pillar would be more appropriate, a bit like post-boxes which often sit on pillars or posts. I can't say I've ever heard of those sitting on piers/piles or pilings !!
As far as your comment about the "Crows Nest" is concerned :-
" How did Crows Nest get its name?
Jimmy Crow statue, Crows Nest Centenary Park. It is claimed by some that the town was named after an Aborigine, Jimmy Crow, who gave directions to early European settlers. He lived in a big hollow tree near the police station, which became known as Crows Nest." en.wikipedia refers.
So that gives a brief comment and I add interestingly that in the case of marine-purposes, they would likely be on a mast or pole and not a pier, even though if on a pier, would still need be on a post or mast to raise to a suitable height.
In fact Rainer, have you ever thought about putting-up a Crows Nest up your offending Palm Tree to overcome the need for using a Pier/Post/Mast, thus allowing you to Sun-Gaze with impunity ?? So if supporting a Crows Nest in your Palm Trees needs a tree as the mast, then why not a tree to support a telescope in the Crows- Nest too... Ha Ha even.
I still 'fink' we should call a telescopes' pier, a post or pillar, so let's see if somebody can put my mind at ease - after about 15-years of my thinking about it... ???
Regards
Terry
Hi James, whilst I agree with your suggestion, I would say that a pier actually sits on either pilings or piers, but effectively the pier itself is the (horizontal) part that acts as a walkway or similar use including railways etc., as in our nearby pier - which apparently is/was the longest in the world at Southend-on-Sea stretching out in to the River Thames for some 1.33 miles (2.14 km).
In fact the Progreso Pier located in the Mexican state of Yucatán as 6.5 Kilometres (4 miles) is longer, but unlike the Southend Pier is for cargo use, compared to our Pleasure Pier. In any case I would find it exceedingly difficult to walk up a pier to the decking it is carrying...
Hi Rainer, No chance of any suitable Sun here and the forecast for the next few days - isn't looking any or much better..
You have submitted another good response and diagram which at least does "support" somewhat the theory that a pier is for "supporting a structure of one sort or another." So on that point alone, should I actually being saying "piering a structure of one sort or another." (as above)
Then again, Lampposts in a street are posts that support lamps/LUMINAIRES etc., of one sort or another, plus the ability to have power-cables inside them - much like telescope "piers" or what I really mean is "Posts/Pillars." Note the similarity of the words Piers and Pillars..
I can of course see from the diagram about "piers" supporting the decking/arches etc., but still feel that for us astronomers, a pole or pillar would be more appropriate, a bit like post-boxes which often sit on pillars or posts. I can't say I've ever heard of those sitting on piers/piles or pilings !!
As far as your comment about the "Crows Nest" is concerned :-
" How did Crows Nest get its name?
Jimmy Crow statue, Crows Nest Centenary Park. It is claimed by some that the town was named after an Aborigine, Jimmy Crow, who gave directions to early European settlers. He lived in a big hollow tree near the police station, which became known as Crows Nest." en.wikipedia refers.
So that gives a brief comment and I add interestingly that in the case of marine-purposes, they would likely be on a mast or pole and not a pier, even though if on a pier, would still need be on a post or mast to raise to a suitable height.
In fact Rainer, have you ever thought about putting-up a Crows Nest up your offending Palm Tree to overcome the need for using a Pier/Post/Mast, thus allowing you to Sun-Gaze with impunity ?? So if supporting a Crows Nest in your Palm Trees needs a tree as the mast, then why not a tree to support a telescope in the Crows- Nest too... Ha Ha even.
I still 'fink' we should call a telescopes' pier, a post or pillar, so let's see if somebody can put my mind at ease - after about 15-years of my thinking about it... ???
Regards
Terry
- DeepSolar64
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 19068
- Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:19 am
- Location: Lowndesville S.C.
- Has thanked: 17853 times
- Been thanked: 16998 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
Telescope piers certainly aren't horizontal. I'm confused.
Lunt 8x32 SUNoculars
Orion 70mm Solar Telescope
Celestron AstroMaster Alt/Az Mount
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 60 DS
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 90 DS
Meade Coronado AZS Alt/Az Mount
Astro-Tech AT72EDII with Altair solar wedge
Celestron NexStar 102GT with Altair solar wedge
Losmandy AZ8 Alt/Az Mount
Sky-Watcher AZGTI Alt-Az GoTo mount
Cameras: ZWO ASI178MM, PGR Grasshopper, PGR Flea
Lunt, Coronado, TeleVue, Orion and Meade eyepieces
Visual Observer
" Way more fun to see it! "
Orion 70mm Solar Telescope
Celestron AstroMaster Alt/Az Mount
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 60 DS
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 90 DS
Meade Coronado AZS Alt/Az Mount
Astro-Tech AT72EDII with Altair solar wedge
Celestron NexStar 102GT with Altair solar wedge
Losmandy AZ8 Alt/Az Mount
Sky-Watcher AZGTI Alt-Az GoTo mount
Cameras: ZWO ASI178MM, PGR Grasshopper, PGR Flea
Lunt, Coronado, TeleVue, Orion and Meade eyepieces
Visual Observer
" Way more fun to see it! "
-
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6871
- Joined: Mon May 18, 2020 4:45 pm
- Location: Essex, S.E.England
- Been thanked: 4900 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
Yes James these type of problems with language can be quite confusing.
I have walked along "piers", but never tried to climb one !! The attached image though, does show that I must have climbed a pole - at least and even sat on one or more...
in fact I am the "Greasy Pole" champion for 1964 at RAF Cosford, where the pole itself was horizontal of course and as can be seen, but the two-ends being supported by angled poles.
Perhaps the winner's cup that I have, should really be called the "1964 Greasy Pier Winner"
(and that is really me in my younger days in the R.A.F.) !!!
At least, that image (as just copied from my PC-screen) is of an original Sun-lit Photo - taken at the time...
Confuscious Say... or is it Confucius Say ???
Terry
I have walked along "piers", but never tried to climb one !! The attached image though, does show that I must have climbed a pole - at least and even sat on one or more...
in fact I am the "Greasy Pole" champion for 1964 at RAF Cosford, where the pole itself was horizontal of course and as can be seen, but the two-ends being supported by angled poles.
Perhaps the winner's cup that I have, should really be called the "1964 Greasy Pier Winner"
(and that is really me in my younger days in the R.A.F.) !!!
At least, that image (as just copied from my PC-screen) is of an original Sun-lit Photo - taken at the time...
Confuscious Say... or is it Confucius Say ???
Terry
- Attachments
-
- IMG_1784 Me winning the Greasy Pole competition.jpg (1020.45 KiB) Viewed 1031 times
- DeepSolar64
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 19068
- Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:19 am
- Location: Lowndesville S.C.
- Has thanked: 17853 times
- Been thanked: 16998 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
That had to be fun!!! I was born in 1964!
Lunt 8x32 SUNoculars
Orion 70mm Solar Telescope
Celestron AstroMaster Alt/Az Mount
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 60 DS
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 90 DS
Meade Coronado AZS Alt/Az Mount
Astro-Tech AT72EDII with Altair solar wedge
Celestron NexStar 102GT with Altair solar wedge
Losmandy AZ8 Alt/Az Mount
Sky-Watcher AZGTI Alt-Az GoTo mount
Cameras: ZWO ASI178MM, PGR Grasshopper, PGR Flea
Lunt, Coronado, TeleVue, Orion and Meade eyepieces
Visual Observer
" Way more fun to see it! "
Orion 70mm Solar Telescope
Celestron AstroMaster Alt/Az Mount
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 60 DS
Meade Coronado SolarMax II 90 DS
Meade Coronado AZS Alt/Az Mount
Astro-Tech AT72EDII with Altair solar wedge
Celestron NexStar 102GT with Altair solar wedge
Losmandy AZ8 Alt/Az Mount
Sky-Watcher AZGTI Alt-Az GoTo mount
Cameras: ZWO ASI178MM, PGR Grasshopper, PGR Flea
Lunt, Coronado, TeleVue, Orion and Meade eyepieces
Visual Observer
" Way more fun to see it! "
-
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6871
- Joined: Mon May 18, 2020 4:45 pm
- Location: Essex, S.E.England
- Been thanked: 4900 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
A tad younger than me James and yes it certainly was fun and with much applause from the crowds (behind the camera)..
I was the shortest person in my squadron there and it was known that I stood the greatest chance of winning throughout that particular event - for simple gravitational-reasons and the lack of the many other competitors realising that fact...
The location (and under-cover there in large hangars) was also used for Olympic-event training for a number of years, so much sport-connections...
The base at RAF Cosford now contains some of the best examples of historical aircraft, some of which I have had a little bit to work-on...
Cheers
Terry
I was the shortest person in my squadron there and it was known that I stood the greatest chance of winning throughout that particular event - for simple gravitational-reasons and the lack of the many other competitors realising that fact...
The location (and under-cover there in large hangars) was also used for Olympic-event training for a number of years, so much sport-connections...
The base at RAF Cosford now contains some of the best examples of historical aircraft, some of which I have had a little bit to work-on...
Cheers
Terry
- marktownley
- Librarian
- Posts: 42550
- Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:27 pm
- Location: Brierley Hills, UK
- Has thanked: 20819 times
- Been thanked: 10491 times
- Contact:
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
I'm fortunate to live about half an hours drive from Cosford, it's a great place!EGRAY_OBSERVATORY wrote: ↑Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:42 am The base at RAF Cosford now contains some of the best examples of historical aircraft, some of which I have had a little bit to work-on...
http://brierleyhillsolar.blogspot.co.uk/
Solar images, a collection of all the most up to date live solar data on the web, imaging & processing tutorials - please take a look!
-
- Way More Fun to Share It!!
- Posts: 6871
- Joined: Mon May 18, 2020 4:45 pm
- Location: Essex, S.E.England
- Been thanked: 4900 times
Re: 31-1-2021 WHEN IS A TELESCOPE-PIER NOT A PIER
That's right Mark. I spent 18-months there and thoroughly enjoyed the experiences.
We had some WW-2 aircraft stored there, which really was the beginning of the current RAF Museum.
The attached aerial-view taken in 1963, shows the training-area. The airfield is on the right (out of view)
Those were the days.
Terry
We had some WW-2 aircraft stored there, which really was the beginning of the current RAF Museum.
The attached aerial-view taken in 1963, shows the training-area. The airfield is on the right (out of view)
Those were the days.
Terry
- Attachments
-
- IMG_1786 RAF COSFORD - July 1963.jpg (1.31 MiB) Viewed 1004 times