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Transit of Mercury in the Spicule Layer. Phil took this great image with his Quantum 6 Scope, Solar Spectrum etalon and PGR Camera.

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PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MapleRidge » Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:31 pm

Hi George...

Thanks for posting the image of the DS system and the description of the spacing and fittings. The basic setup of the OTA/DSII is pretty much the same as I have with the Celestron OTA and DSII module. Spacing of a Quark should work, though more spacers likely will be needed since I don't use a binoviewer.

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Merlin66 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:50 am

Marty,
Another factor would be the amount of off band; the further from the Ha CWL the more likely the chance to pick up the Continuum......
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:23 am

Looking at the unstretched pictures taken with the Quark, and then Quark + PST, both are wide bandpass. Be interesting to see what a 'raw' unstretched / no contrast full disk looks like with your PST. Personally I think you have 2 'wide' etalons. Here's a shot with my Quark double stacked with a naked PST etalon on my ED80 from 2017.

Imageha-active-regions-q80-colour by Mark Townley, on Flickr
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:16 pm

Good point about being on band. I'm probably off-band a little. I usually try to push towards the blue side as it seems to have more contrast on the surface. But that was the Quark by itself. If I ever get a clear day, I will try to tune the Quark and the PST and try to document it with different examples at the limb. That could very well be the problem! I figured if my filaments were dark, it was on band, but maybe it's not?

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Bob Yoesle » Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:02 pm

Looks like you nailed it Mark! Your greyscale is perfect:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/brierleyh ... otostream/
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Tue Jan 08, 2019 5:43 pm

Heya,

I managed to test a little bit today. I tried tuning the Quark differently to see if I could match the PST. I usually tune the Quark to 9 o'clock as I find it has more contrast there. Tuning the Quark at 12 o'clock was my first round of testing, but then clouds came in. I think it helped a little? Didn't solve the issue with the double limb, but I think it improved it. So maybe I'm just not tuned to match on each etalon quite yet?

I also noticed in some places I could see the double limb, and in others, it seemed to be supressed. Maybe some kind of sweet spot? Or an issue with tilt or being on/off band? Not uniform?

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Image

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:28 pm

I think this is an improvement Marty, that first image is a cracker!
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Bob Yoesle » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:27 pm

These are a major improvement Marty! Very much closer to being on band I would say.
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Wed Jan 09, 2019 7:29 pm

Some more testing today.

I left the Quark at 12 o'clock and then just tuned the PST a little back and forth to see what would happen. It would basically go from a featureless grey smear to a starkly over-exposed white. So between the two I just went for the most uniform across the FOV with contrast. Tested it on the limb and on the current AR to compare to yesterday's. Still a hint of the double limb present I think.

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:35 pm

You're getting there Marty. Like I mentioned, I think both of your etalons have a wide passband. You're doing a lot of stretching / contrast etc in your post processing which I think also enhances the ghost of the double limb.

When I double stack in the quark and PST my tuning process is to tune the PST etalon to get uniform illumination, then to tune the quark to get onband.
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:11 pm

Thanks Mark, that's a good point about starting with the PST and then the Quark for tuning. I'll try that next session.

Very best,

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Valery » Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:58 am

MalVeauX wrote:
Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:11 pm
Thanks Mark, that's a good point about starting with the PST and then the Quark for tuning. I'll try that next session.

Very best,
Due to a small size of a PST sweet spot, this will probably work only for a very narrow FOV.

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:37 am

Valery wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:58 am
MalVeauX wrote:
Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:11 pm
Thanks Mark, that's a good point about starting with the PST and then the Quark for tuning. I'll try that next session.

Very best,
Due to a small size of a PST sweet spot, this will probably work only for a very narrow FOV.

Valery
The PST etalon is in a telecentric beam so i'm not seeing a sweet spot Valery in my setup (f43 or f32)- sweet spot is only in a collimated light beam.
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Valery » Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:38 pm

marktownley wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:37 am

The PST etalon is in a telecentric beam so i'm not seeing a sweet spot Valery in my setup (f43 or f32)- sweet spot is only in a collimated light beam.
Hah! I thinked that you adviced to use a PST etalon in it's native F/10 - collimation - refocusing mode and then use a Quark with it's telecentric! My mistake.
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:19 pm

Heya,

Had a chance to try and test tuning again. I tuned the Quark far blue and far red to see which direction was the closest to match the PST etalon. The red shift was the worst of the two directions. The blue shift, all the way, where my Quark is normally sitting, was off a bit too. But I found around 10~11 o'clock on the Quark and a little gentle sweeping through the pressure range on the PST etalon allowed me to get a little closer to being on band. Still not quite there. But maybe a little closer than before? I started marking on the components where to align them so I know where to start next time and will keep testing and tweaking what can be done with this.

Image

Image

Image

Image
Quark_PSTEtalon_Tuned.jpg
Quark_PSTEtalon_Tuned.jpg (116.43 KiB) Viewed 1832 times
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:14 am

They're all good but I do like number 4. Any chance you could put an unprocessed (straight from stack) version of this image? I'm curious as to what your raw data looks like before processing.
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:19 pm

marktownley wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:14 am
They're all good but I do like number 4. Any chance you could put an unprocessed (straight from stack) version of this image? I'm curious as to what your raw data looks like before processing.
Sure thing,

Here's the Quark on it's own and the Quark + PST Etalon, no processing, just raw output from 100 frames stacked.

Quark (single):
Exposed to fill histogram to try to get as much into one shot as possible to test processing.
Quark_SS_Limb_01.jpg
Quark_SS_Limb_01.jpg (82.74 KiB) Viewed 1804 times
Quark + PST Etalon (double):
Exposed to fill histogram without clipping to again get as much into one shot as possible to test processing.
Quark_PST_DS_01.jpg
Quark_PST_DS_01.jpg (119.25 KiB) Viewed 1804 times
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by george9 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 8:48 pm

Very nice improvement. There was a bump of a prom with a filaprom to a subtle AR below it today (much like what I see above), but if these were taken yesterday, it would have moved by now. Amazing what the processing brings out (earlier post).

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:21 pm

Heya,

I tried some more tuning options and processing options and I'm happier with the results today on the limb. Even though the double limb is not 100% eliminated, it makes processing it out a lot easier and more natural looking to me at least. Here's today's results under really excellent seeing (the limb was a treat to just watch despite no major features):

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Mosaic made with an ST80 masked to 60mm with the same imaging train. 4 images stitched together.

Image
SolarSetup_ST80_01132019.jpg
SolarSetup_ST80_01132019.jpg (91.03 KiB) Viewed 1774 times
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:33 pm

Spot on Marty!
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MapleRidge » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:44 pm

Hi Marty...

These images are really sharp and the limb details show so much detail despite being such small proms. Your setup is working very nicely :bow

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Bob Yoesle » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:27 pm

Hi Marty,

Upon reflection and going back to some references, I believe there could be a couple of things going on with your images. The recent images are better with regard to the double limb, but it is still subtly revealing itself. According to Bray & Loughhead in The Solar Chromosphere (1974, page 19):

A second consequence of tuning the filter progressively further into the wings of the line is the eventual re-appearance of the photospheric limb, even in the absence of of parasitic light. ... high-resolution observations show that the photospheric limb first begins to re-appear at Ha +/- 0.65 A... As one moves further out from the centre line, the photospheric limb rapidly becomes more prominent and appears as a sharp regular boundary crossed at irregular intervals by isolated chromospheric features (Plate 2.8)... If the bandwidth of the filter is sufficiently broad it follows [from the foregoing] that the photospheric limb will be present, regardless of the wavelength setting of the filter.

Plate 2.8 SM.jpg
Plate 2.8 SM.jpg (57.81 KiB) Viewed 1598 times

From your images, the presence of the double limb can represent that the filter system bandpass is perhaps a bit too wide to completely eliminate parasitic continuum from the photosphere. However, it seems to be more likely that you simply are tuned a little too far off the H alpha line. I have noted many of your images look somewhat "peculiar." I thought this might be due to excessive processing as noted by Mark. I believe the plates below demonstrate you may indeed be +/- 0.5 A or more off-band with most of your images, which seem to show the "dark mottles" that are more prominent off-band, but which are largely absent when on-band:

Plate 2.5 SM.jpg
Plate 2.5 SM.jpg (65.48 KiB) Viewed 1598 times
Plate 2.6 SM.jpg
Plate 2.6 SM.jpg (66.66 KiB) Viewed 1598 times
Plate 3.1 SM.jpg
Plate 3.1 SM.jpg (72.96 KiB) Viewed 1598 times
Plate 3.4 SM.jpg
Plate 3.4 SM.jpg (75.13 KiB) Viewed 1598 times

The predominance of the dark "spiky" mottles in your (positive) images appear to reveal you are perhaps +/- 0.5 A off-band as seen in Plate 2.6 and 3.4, and the double limb might indicate you have some additional leaking continuum from filter band-pass issues (e.g. transmission profile "wings"). On the other hand, you might be tuned closer to +/- 0.65 A, and the double limb would be present no matter what the filter system bandpass is.

The only way to tell if you have a band-pass issue (continuum leakage) is to get tuned on-band, and if you are not seeing a double limb, then you have very good double stacked filter performance, and going off-band and seeing the double limb is normal.
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by marktownley » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:51 pm

MalVeauX wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 1:19 pm
marktownley wrote:
Sun Jan 13, 2019 11:14 am
They're all good but I do like number 4. Any chance you could put an unprocessed (straight from stack) version of this image? I'm curious as to what your raw data looks like before processing.
Sure thing,

Here's the Quark on it's own and the Quark + PST Etalon, no processing, just raw output from 100 frames stacked.

Quark (single):
Exposed to fill histogram to try to get as much into one shot as possible to test processing.

Quark_SS_Limb_01.jpg

Quark + PST Etalon (double):
Exposed to fill histogram without clipping to again get as much into one shot as possible to test processing.

Quark_PST_DS_01.jpg

Very best,

Try your stacking with 'cropped ' selected on AS3 Marty 👍
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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by MalVeauX » Sat Jan 19, 2019 11:27 pm

Thanks all,

Will test more as soon as these storms pass!

Very best,

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Re: PST Etalon with a Quark, Log & Results

Post by Merlin66 » Sat Jan 19, 2019 11:38 pm

Marty,
I've started to play "seriously" with imppg to hopefully improve my processing skills.
One thing I do notice is that depending on the processing I can "pull" the double edge out of almost any image....
As per my previous early comments I think CWL on Ha is a clear winner to reduce the double edge but it may also be aggravated by your processing techniques?
Just trying to help.....
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