AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

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AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by GreatAttractor »

The seeing on Thursday was mediocre, but my 3-hour session yielded a few good stacks. All taken with Intes M715, Baader ND 3.8 solar film + Solar Continuum filter, Blackfly S (IMX 273), processed with AS!3 and ImPPG.
ar_3038.png
ar_3038.png (426.87 KiB) Viewed 2099 times
High-cadence granulation time lapse (my first; the old ones from 2012 used 1-4 minute intervals, here it's just 15 s, 9 minutes total):
granu.gif
granu.gif (1.67 MiB) Viewed 2099 times
Finally, a fast-forward animation spanning the whole session (3:11 h total); note the twist of the lower sunspots and the dis/appearing pores:

https://www.cloudynights.com/gallery/im ... ime-lapse/

(video can be looped via right-click)


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by marktownley »

That Intes seems to be working very well, the animation is fascinating to watch!


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by rigel123 »

Awesome!


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by torsinadoc »

I really like WL animations. Great job


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by arnedanielsen »

Beautiful image and very cool animations, Filip!

Thanks for sharing,
Arne


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by DeepSolar64 »

The Sun's photosphere behaves as if it's a liquid though it's actually a very hot plasma. Filip, your animations show this so clearly in a way no still image can.

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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by ffellah »

Superb image and granulation movie, Filip.

Franco


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by nicosolcy »

Has a feeling of 3-dimensionality as the sunspots appear to show depth!


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by Montana »

Beautiful WL :bow :bow :hamster:

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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by vineyard »

A beautiful image, and really awesome to see the movement as well - they're alive :lol:


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

This is a nice image, so you used a Mak, i have a cheap one of same this Mak, so it means it can be done with a Mak for WL, but i have a cheap solar film ND5.0, can this be ok?


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by marktownley »

TareqPhoto wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:17 pm This is a nice image, so you used a Mak, i have a cheap one of same this Mak, so it means it can be done with a Mak for WL, but i have a cheap solar film ND5.0, can this be ok?
It will just give much longer exposure times, which may be an issue depending on your seeing conditions.


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by GreatAttractor »

TareqPhoto wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:17 pm but i have a cheap solar film ND5.0, can this be ok?
Will work under certain conditions, see this post.


My software:
Stackistry — an open-source cross-platform image stacker
ImPPG — stack post-processing and animation alignment
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SW Mak-Cass 127, ATM Hα scopes (90 mm, 200 mm), Lunt LS50THa, ATM SSM, ATM Newt 300/1500 mm, PGR Chameleon 3 mono (ICX445)
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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

marktownley wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 9:04 am
TareqPhoto wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:17 pm This is a nice image, so you used a Mak, i have a cheap one of same this Mak, so it means it can be done with a Mak for WL, but i have a cheap solar film ND5.0, can this be ok?
It will just give much longer exposure times, which may be an issue depending on your seeing conditions.
Honestly, i am only worry about the quality of that solar film because it is cheap, but i bought it as it can be used anyway, they won't sell it if it is very dangerous and not safe at all, i checked it against strong LED lights in my house and it was like they are all off and i am in darkness, then i placed against the sun somewhere near the window and it blocked that sunlight completely, and i risked again to look by my eyes for 1 sec or 2 and i saw that sun as a poor small yellow dot, but is that enough to be sure it is safe?

About exposure, i can always crank the exposure, i have many different cameras even i can use cooled ones if i must increase gain, the point is, if i didn't try then i won't know, but i will never risk or gamble and play with the sun until i have ALL safe and ready stuff to start.


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

GreatAttractor wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:15 pm
TareqPhoto wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:17 pm but i have a cheap solar film ND5.0, can this be ok?
Will work under certain conditions, see this post.
What conditions? How to know?


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

Ok, let's be clear and honest, i buy many stuff cheap so i can have more, i sacrifice quality to get quantity, in the past in the photography era when i was in that field before i stop and giving up and then getting into astro i was only thinking about quality expensive, it didn't help me much, and i saw others with cheap gear did great already, so now for astro i try to have both but more of cheap than quality.

Can you recommend me any cheap really cheap ready round mounted ND3.8 filters so i can order it for my scopes and ignoring that ND5.0 i have? Cheap for me is less than $200 for this solar filter ND at any size.


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by marktownley »

TareqPhoto wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:41 pm Can you recommend me any cheap really cheap ready round mounted ND3.8 filters so i can order it for my scopes and ignoring that ND5.0 i have? Cheap for me is less than $200 for this solar filter ND at any size.
Baader are not making the ND3.8 any more, they are only making the ND5 :(


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by GreatAttractor »

TareqPhoto wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:35 pm
GreatAttractor wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:15 pm
TareqPhoto wrote: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:17 pm but i have a cheap solar film ND5.0, can this be ok?
Will work under certain conditions, see this post.
What conditions? How to know?
Just what's mentioned in the post:

1) don't use very big F-numbers (i.e., don't Barlow too much)
2) don't use very narrowband filters (e.g., Solar Continuum)

The goal is to keep the exposure time below 15 ms or so. Both points 1, 2 tend to increase this time.


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ImPPG — stack post-processing and animation alignment
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SW Mak-Cass 127, ATM Hα scopes (90 mm, 200 mm), Lunt LS50THa, ATM SSM, ATM Newt 300/1500 mm, PGR Chameleon 3 mono (ICX445)
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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by athornett »

I think this video is incredible. You have shown how the granules expand and then burst just like the bubbling on a boiling kettle. Wow!
Andy


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

marktownley wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 4:02 am
TareqPhoto wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:41 pm Can you recommend me any cheap really cheap ready round mounted ND3.8 filters so i can order it for my scopes and ignoring that ND5.0 i have? Cheap for me is less than $200 for this solar filter ND at any size.
Baader are not making the ND3.8 any more, they are only making the ND5 :(
The problem is that they still selling that ND 3.8 but as sheets, then we cut it for different scopes, but i really hate to buy and cut and DIY for different scopes, i am not good at all with that, i can buy that sheet easily because cheap, hopefully one day i can learn about how to cut and then mount it on something round or square for the scope safely.


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

GreatAttractor wrote: Sun Jul 03, 2022 10:10 am
TareqPhoto wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 10:35 pm
GreatAttractor wrote: Sat Jul 02, 2022 3:15 pm

Will work under certain conditions, see this post.
What conditions? How to know?
Just what's mentioned in the post:

1) don't use very big F-numbers (i.e., don't Barlow too much)
2) don't use very narrowband filters (e.g., Solar Continuum)

The goal is to keep the exposure time below 15 ms or so. Both points 1, 2 tend to increase this time.
Well, i was planning to use with a Continuum filter, and adding UV/IR cut filter too as an extra protection ERF, so all that will kill the exposure time with ND5.0?

So, i should use something fast scope if i want to use ND5.0, so how fast is fast? Like F4 or F5 maybe? I bought this solar film ND5.0 for my Mak and it is F/15 native, i will not use any barlow ofcourse, but is that F/15 too much? What if i used something like 0.5x reducer, will that help although it is a cheap 2" 0.5x reducer that might degrade the overall quality?!!!


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by GreatAttractor »

TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 12:32 am Well, i was planning to use with a Continuum filter, and adding UV/IR cut filter too as an extra protection ERF, so all that will kill the exposure time with ND5.0?
At f/15, yes; if you have a "visual" red or green filter, try them instead of the Solar Continuum. BTW, you don't need the UV/IR-cut for energy rejection; neither the ND 3.8 nor ND 5.0 film requires it. The reason to use UV/IR cut is to limit the influence of seeing and atmospheric dispersion, and in refractors, to avoid blurry image due to different wavelengths being focused at different points.
TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 12:32 am I bought this solar film ND5.0 for my Mak and it is F/15 native, i will not use any barlow ofcourse, but is that F/15 too much?
For pixel sizes around 3-4 µm, f/15 is close to critical (optimal) sampling, so it should be OK. Unless you have a 2 µm-pixel camera - in that case I'd try with a reducer.


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ImPPG — stack post-processing and animation alignment
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SW Mak-Cass 127, ATM Hα scopes (90 mm, 200 mm), Lunt LS50THa, ATM SSM, ATM Newt 300/1500 mm, PGR Chameleon 3 mono (ICX445)
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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

GreatAttractor wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 1:55 pm
TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 12:32 am Well, i was planning to use with a Continuum filter, and adding UV/IR cut filter too as an extra protection ERF, so all that will kill the exposure time with ND5.0?
At f/15, yes; if you have a "visual" red or green filter, try them instead of the Solar Continuum. BTW, you don't need the UV/IR-cut for energy rejection; neither the ND 3.8 nor ND 5.0 film requires it. The reason to use UV/IR cut is to limit the influence of seeing and atmospheric dispersion, and in refractors, to avoid blurry image due to different wavelengths being focused at different points.
TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 12:32 am I bought this solar film ND5.0 for my Mak and it is F/15 native, i will not use any barlow ofcourse, but is that F/15 too much?
For pixel sizes around 3-4 µm, f/15 is close to critical (optimal) sampling, so it should be OK. Unless you have a 2 µm-pixel camera - in that case I'd try with a reducer.
Ah ok, i thought we have to use that UV/IR cut always for white light, now i am getting corrected, new things to learn, so i will will not use one if i use that ND5.0 then.

I have different cameras, from 2.4um up to 5.XYZum, but the only two non cooled mono i have are 2.9um and 5.something [ASI174MM], that 2.9um is the best match for F/15.

Again, i asked, if i will use ND5.0, can i use a fast scope then like F/4 or F/5? Even if i use Powermate 2x i still be at F/8 and F/10.


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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by GreatAttractor »

TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 3:24 pm Ah ok, i thought we have to use that UV/IR cut always for white light, now i am getting corrected, new things to learn, so i will will not use one if i use that ND5.0 then.
Sorry, I was unclear - you should still use an UV/IR-cut for the reasons I listed (it's just not for energy rejection). Unless you're using something like Baader Red 610 nm long pass filter (then you're passing IR on purpose).
TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 3:24 pm Again, i asked, if i will use ND5.0, can i use a fast scope then like F/4 or F/5? Even if i use Powermate 2x i still be at F/8 and F/10.
Yes, you can. Just go ahead and experiment. As long as you put ND 5.0 or ND 3.8 film at the front of the 'scope, you won't break anything (at most, the image will be too bright and you'll need to add some 1.25" ND filter on camera's side).


My software:
Stackistry — an open-source cross-platform image stacker
ImPPG — stack post-processing and animation alignment
My images

SW Mak-Cass 127, ATM Hα scopes (90 mm, 200 mm), Lunt LS50THa, ATM SSM, ATM Newt 300/1500 mm, PGR Chameleon 3 mono (ICX445)
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Re: AR 3038 in WL + granulation time lapse

Post by TareqPhoto »

GreatAttractor wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 5:58 pm
TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 3:24 pm Ah ok, i thought we have to use that UV/IR cut always for white light, now i am getting corrected, new things to learn, so i will will not use one if i use that ND5.0 then.
Sorry, I was unclear - you should still use an UV/IR-cut for the reasons I listed (it's just not for energy rejection). Unless you're using something like Baader Red 610 nm long pass filter (then you're passing IR on purpose).
TareqPhoto wrote: Sun Jul 10, 2022 3:24 pm Again, i asked, if i will use ND5.0, can i use a fast scope then like F/4 or F/5? Even if i use Powermate 2x i still be at F/8 and F/10.
Yes, you can. Just go ahead and experiment. As long as you put ND 5.0 or ND 3.8 film at the front of the 'scope, you won't break anything (at most, the image will be too bright and you'll need to add some 1.25" ND filter on camera's side).
Ok, got it, thank you very much


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